paul.h

Some of the parts I replaced probably did not need doing but the car was going to be used in Hull by our daughter so had to be reliable. At least now you have inspected your timing belt and it looks ok so you know there is no rush to replace it. The pulleys on the auxiliary belt will not need doing if they spin and look ok. Since they are not part of the timing belt, any problems should not end up in engine damage. Ours seemed ok but then I had already bought them and being a special order could not be returned. Since the water pump is driven by the timing belt you need to make sure it is not leaking and spins ok without side play from the bearing. If it does fail later it will mean the same work as for timing belt renewal. The old one on our car seemed ok when I replaced it so probably did not need doing but then I was trying to prevent the earlier high temperature problem. So minimum cost of doing the timing belt and its tensioner is about £58 if you get the kit from such as Eurocarparts and if you want/need to replace the aux belt a further £17. The other bits you just need to check they are ok.

There is a French ETAI RTA manual available for the latest C5, Amazon's French site sell it. Old versions of Citroen's manuals are sometimes available from ebay on DVD plus if you register on service.citroen website you can purchase manuals although I have never done this, but the parts diagrams are free to look at.

The ticket clip was from a Citroen dealer part no. 8328 GG with the name Pliers, cost £3.27. It can be seen on the parts diagrams for the mark 1 C5 and the C3. To fit the clip the windscreen pillar trim has to be removed since it slots in to a part of the trim which is not possible with the trim in place. You may have gathered from the above I solved my problem of wanting a heavier car for towing our caravan by getting the estate. It took a year to find one on a low enough mileage since there have been very few for sale. I was not particularly after the 2.2 hdi but it was the first estate not too far away with a lower mileage than our hatchback.

The pedal is held by 2 nuts in the driver's footwell and an electrical connector, so easy to do but a torch and mirror will help. The top cover of the timing belt is held only by 2 nuts so I look at ours every year to give confidence it will last - look at the belt for any damage, cracking, oil contamination. When I replaced it (40k miles, 8½ years), it still looked good enough to last - the replacement interval for the petrol engine is every 10 years or 48k miles in severe service or 75k miles for normal use. If the belt breaks it could cause engine damage so to exceed the recommended intervals is a bit of a gamble on any car so nobody will advise to exceed them. A dealer will charge about £300 to replace it. When I did it last year the belt and tensioner were £63 from Bentleys. I also replaced the auxiliary belt which was cracking and its 2 pulleys £17 and £116, the water pump £57, the thermostat £14, anti freeze £14. I was keen to do the coolant bits since a couple of times it gave a high temperature but I think this was an electrical glitch. Replacement was as per the Haynes manual but you need a couple of engine locking tools - an 8mm diameter bolt for the camshaft pulley (Haynes says 10 but it was 8 on our car), a 6mm diameter rod bent to fit in the flywheel locking hole - I used some threaded bar about 700mm long which I happened to have from Toolstation. Getting the right shape was trial and error the day before doing the timing belt and the dimensions in Haynes are wrong, a web on the engine near the hole gets in the way but the straight bit to go through the hole needs to be about 35mm long plus max about 10mm radius bend to clear the web and then a long bit to the top of the engine to make it easy to use. If you replace the coolant it is very slow to refill and also get the air out without the header tank as shown in Haynes. I found that applying vacuum to the cylinder head air bleed hole and with the car slightly raised at the left side (where the bleed points are) worked. Vacuum was from a Mityvac brake bleeder with the bleed hose held against the air bleed hole but a syringe may do. On start up though I could still hear some air going round the heater for a short while. There was a post on the C3 subforum where somebody had air going round after changing the coolant.

Interesting post qman3428 and maybe you have helped demonstrate the point - at the end of 2010 I changed to a heavier caravan and was looking for a heavier car than the mark 1 C5 hatchback we had. I was seriously considering the new C5 tourer but had read that if fitted with the optional larger wheels and lower profile tyres it suffered from tyre/road noise and this was shown to be the case when we had a test drive in a new exclusive with 19 inch wheels. So if it had the standard 17 inch wheels it would have been ok. In the end we got a mark 2 C5 estate and not a tourer since to get the self leveling suspension needed for towing we would need an exclusive model and with a reasonable mileage these are too expensive but more importantly we found it was too wide to fit through our garage door.

If you go to the service.citroen website you can see/print the handbook for recent cars without registering. One for an early C3 is not available but there will not be much difference in the later ones. I have found the easiest way to print a section is to use a right click on the mouse. If you have still to start the service: - to remove the air filter, remove the complete filter box before trying to take the top off since there are screws at the back which can not be reached. I always clean the throttle plate with carb cleaner. - when replacing the spark plugs, at the air filter end of the coil pack is an earth wire which needs to be removed but needs a very thin spanner to undo the lock nut or the wire will twist and eventually break - when remaking the connection I did something to let a normal spanner fit, may have been adding some washers but I can not remember and the car is not here to be able to check. I made a note in my Haynes book that when replacing no. 3 spark plug to remove the throttle body to help access if the air filter is being replaced at the same time. - the oil filter cover needs a 27mm socket to undo it and the drain plug a 8mm square section key. - at the last oil change I used Castrol magnatec 5w30 A1 full synthetic since it was on offer at Asda and Halfords last year.

The air con leak point can be seen by looking through the front grill where a pipe connects to the left side (when seen from the front) of the condenser matrix. It has been advised by iannez on the C3 subforum to grease this pipe at the connection to prevent corrosion. I think repair is replacement of the pipe but you should be able to see if it is badly corroded enough to be leaking. To seal the bonnet it was a case of pushing up the washer jets and applying a bit of black sealant under the jets. The washer piping is plastic and does not give a good seal against the plastic washer jets and a T connector so I replaced the piping with some rubber pipe but I can not remember where I got it from. If you look at the top of the injectors, look for staining on the injector coils, there are 2 holes on each coil which let in the water to the coils and then rusting and failure. I also put in a bit of sealant in these holes but this may have been a bit excessive. In winter, the washer jets can easily freeze and if you run the washer pump for more than a second or so its fuse can blow. The fuse (may be F8, red 10 amp) is in the under bonnet fuse box at the left of the battery. To remove its cover, first pull off the battery covers and then to undo the fuse box retaining clip use a small screwdriver to lever it off from the rear of the clip - it takes a bit of practise. You also have to do this to replace any of the left front light bulbs due to limited access. We found the original battery is a bit small if only doing short journeys and eventually replaced it with a heavier duty one from Eurocarparts - the voltage can still fall to about 12.3 but it is large enough to still rapidly spin the engine in winter. When the voltage is low, on starting it can give 3 warning beeps - see handbook for the other causes of this warning. Our local Citroen dealer is Bentleys on Manchester Road, Warrington and they are good, very friendly and parts are usually not too expensive. An aircon recharge is about £40 so they are probably competitive if you need this doing. If you get a Haynes manual, WMP on Manchester Road, Warrington sells them at a low price. DIY servicing of the car is easy enough but if you need to clean the back brakes the hub nuts and hub nut caps need to be replaced each time but are only a few £ from a dealer. Citroen use a long life anti freeze that normally does not need replacing but if you need any get it from Citroen to get the correct type, it was about £15 for 3 litres last year when I replaced the timing belt. If you want to see the same parts diagrams as the dealers, register on the website service.citroen.com via the inscription button, this is allowed in the terms and conditions as a member of an automobile club (this one, the Citroen Owners Club). You can also pay to use other documents such as wiring diagrams/ workshop manuals but the Haynes manual is good enough.

We have a 2003 1.4 petrol SX and it has been ok so far, easy to drive (although not fast), light clutch pedal, good brakes, a bit small on busy motorways giving me a vulnerable feeling compared to our C5, good in snow and only problems outside normal servicing are the usual ones of petrol injector failure and front suspension coil spring failure - you will know if these are faulty since the car will not run properly (engine management light will be on also) and the springs can be checked just by looking at them (most people have had broken springs replaced free by Citroen dealers). Also check the air conditioning (if installed) works since a pipe connection at the front condensor can corrode and leak. The injector failure is caused by water ingress through the bonnet where the windscreen jets go through and also from the water pipe connections to the jets - injector failure can occur after heavy rain (our case and 2 failed). I sealed the bonnet and replaced the plastic water pipe with rubber and had no problems since 2007. Tyres last a long time (35k miles or more) and could perish due to age before wearing out. At 10 years old the timing belt/tensioner/water pump should have been replaced. The front driver's seat cushion may have lost a bit of foam at the door side so check it is still ok. The manual will give about 45 mpg. The models below SX do not have rear headrests but can be fitted. The temperature gauge should be on 3 bars (out of 6) after about 2 miles and stay there - the cabin heater is one of the best in a car we have had so should be nice and hot. If it is not easy to start off (smooth acceleration from low revs) it could be it needs a new accelerator pedal (about £40) since the electrical potentiometer can wear. Body work rust should not be a problem. The rear exhaust box is held on by a metal strap which can corrode but is not available separately and a Citroen full exhaust is about £300 - we fit an aftermarket one (Klarius from Eurocarparts £100) but it resonates at tickover and about 2500 rpm spoiling the car - this has also been reported by another poster on a diesel on the C3 subforum. Servicing is every 2 years so make sure a decent oil is used - ours still looks clean after 2 years. The engine also runs cleanly and inside the exhaust tail pipe is clean. The roof black plastic side strips can come loose at the ends, gluing can work but in the end I replaced ours and found the type of plastic had changed. If there is a rattle from underneath it may be the exhaust heat shield needs fastening back on using large repair washers. If there is a knocking from the front suspension it could be the anti roll bar drop links need replacing (£30 each side) but this would be picked up in an MOT. If you need a decent larger car that is as economical as a C3 petrol and costs less to buy, also consider a C5 2 litre diesel. Ours has been as reliable as the C3 and if you post on the C5 subforum there are plenty of people who will advise and they seem to be good for 200k miles - ask coastline taxis who is one of our respected expert posters.

If you do go for larger wheels with lower profile tyres you may end up with road noise - the new C5 tourer / saloon has been noted for this. You may also partly lose one of the best reasons for the C5, its smooth ride.

From the parts diagrams the wiring loom appears to run up the left windscreen pillar to the front of the roof with 6 connectors so one of these is probably for the rear view mirror. Recently I removed the right pillar plastic trim (starting at the top just pull it towards the centre of the car to remove it) and noticed some wires running up the pillar, I am not sure but these could be for the radio/sat nav (our car is a 2007 2.2 VTX estate). I was doing this to fit a ticket clip as was on our mark 1 C5.

This is from Haynes: Remove ignition key and wait at least 1 minute. Remove the plastic plug at the interior release handle and the revealed torx bolt then remove the handle surround. Prise away the grab handle outer trim and starting from the rear, prise up the window switch panel and disconnect its plug. Carefully prise away the mirror trim panel. Undo the torx bolts in the grab handle. Prise off the loud speaker panel, undo the screws and remove the speaker. Undo the 2 torx bolts in the speaker aperture. Prise down the light unit from the lower edge of the door trim if there is one, and disconnect the plug. Remove the plastic cap from the rear edge of the door trim and undo the torx bolt. The door panel is still held on with plastic clips along the 4 edges - Haynes says to use a flat bladed tool to unclip these and then lift the panel to detach it from the window seal. The window regulator is held by 4 rivets which need to be drilled out so maybe the old ones are still inside the door rattling about at the bottom.

The parts diagrams on the service.citroen site show the wiring connectors at the seats are a short section to other connectors possibly inside the seat. The manual and electric seats have different part nos for these short sections. It may be part of these other connectors are the same on the electric and manual seats (I do not know) to cover the air bags and whatever lets the car know the seat is occupied - if so, then the electric seat parts may just need a 12 volt supply and the car may already be wired up for this, the loom runs down the left sill (accessed by pulling up the plastic sill cover). On the mark 2 C5, the fused supply for the electric seats is one of the G fuses on the yellow permanent (direct from the battery via a maxi fuse) supply inside the glovebox fuse box (see car handbook). However, if you do end up cutting wires for the air bags in the seats it is probably best to solder them and use shrink insulation over the joints. Obviously disconnect the car battery before doing any disconnections and reconnections and reconnect the battery with nobody in the car in case an air bag goes off. When I wired the towbar on our mark 2 estate, the yellow strip has a 12 volt towbar supply with a thick beige wire to the back of the car, fuse G36. For the supply for the trailer lights, I used a spare supply from the yellow strip by pushing in a spade connector into the top hole for the fuse and crimped to the wire with a fuse to the towbar - these give possibilties for a supply for the electric seats if it is not already there.

+APC I think is the 12 volt supply with the ignition switch key in the drive position i.e. the position after the accessories (+ACC) but before the operation of the starter - it should allow such as the fog lights to work. When replacing the BSI and ECU have these been matched to each other and the car or is this what you are trying to do ?

The site looks good, however, I do not know if it is my PC or this site but when trying to open the forum posts it keeps getting hung up seeming to be looking for adverts and facebook in the address bar so I have to stop Internet Explorer and retry and usually give up.

I got the chance to check our C3 MOT work at the weekend and was not impressed. We were new customers for Evans Hallshaw Citroen in Hull but are unlikely to use them again. All 6 indicator bulbs had been replaced but to do the front left you remove the battery and fuse box covers for access. The fuse box cover retaining clip is tricky to undo (I have done it a few times, the clip has to be levered off from the back with a small screwdriver) but found the clip lower retaining lug had simply been cut off leaving the cover loose and liable to let water in - as a fix I used a screw in place of the lug to hold it down. I also found the air filter box 90° turn plastic retainer clip was missing - this would not come out on its own so possibly the filter box had also been moved. Finally, the clip holding the right hand headlight bulb cover was not fully on. All simple things but if this is how they treat the car of a new customer I will not use them. It is 2 months since the MOT so there is little point in complaining and now it would be difficult to show they were responsible.

The rear heat shield on our C3 came loose this week and it was fixed back on using large repair washers, fortunately before it became damaged.

Deleted due to double posting - the forum has changed and this is my first posting since then - after using the post button, the screen did not change so I thought it had not been saved.

For the model without the electric handbrake: Both sides should wind back in the same way - clockwise. To change pads - unclip the brake hose and undo the 2 caliper bolts (35 Nm) then lift the caliper off to reveal the pads.

If the shelf is for the estate, mark 1 C5 up to RPO 09428 has part no. 8794LE Storm, then has part no. 8794NW Tramonte which also is for the mark 2 C5 estate. The parts diagrams do not show the difference. However, the shelf brackets at each side have the same part nos. so it looks as if a shelf will fit all models of estate. The diagrams do not show a blind. If the shelf and blind are for the hatchback, the mark 1 and mark 2 C5s have different part nos. Mark 1 is 8796xx (xx being different depending on RPO no. and if a rear wiper is fitted) and mark 2 is 8342FG without a blind and 8342FH including the blind - the blind on its own is 8342FJ (mark 1 blind is 8342CY). Again the shelf brackets for mark 1 and 2 have the same part nos. The mark 2 is a bit longer than the mark 1 with a larger boot volume so maybe the shelf is longer, the diagrams show it being a round shape at the back where the mark 1 is straight. You can see the parts diagrams on the service.citroen website if you register - allowed as a member of a car club such as this - see the terms/conditions. Without registering you can only see car handbooks.

Sometimes a Citroen dealer or a Citroen specialist may be a lower cost to do a repair than a garage that does not specialise in Citroens. They should have the experience/knowledge of your car and the equipment to diagnose a fault and repair it quickly. The dealer may also have a lower labour rate for older cars so they are competitive.

Maybe you could try a quote from a Citroen dealer with a lower labour rate, I think ours is about £80/hour but for older cars is less. For new model cars they now have to or will have to have tyre pressure sensors fitted and working (some new European rules). In the latest MOT testers manual, checks of this monitoring system only apply to cars first used on or from 1/1/2012 so for now, on older cars it should not be part of the MOT test.

Not seen this one before. Could the contacts in the ignition switch or maybe the contacts in the starter motor solenoid need a clean or a relay ?

The parts diagram does not show if the motor to fold the mirror is in the mirror housing or the base fastened to the door but it has its own part number so will be available.

I just googled c3 recall and an AA site came up listing the safety recalls against build date and VIN. Fitting cups on the front suspension struts in case/when the springs break was the only one listed for our car but that was done. If there is something and you can not easily see if it has been done then your dealer will be able to tell you.

On an old brochure from 2002, it gives the mark 1 C5 2.2 hdi estate auto fuel figures as urban 28.5 mpg, extra urban 52.3 mpg, combined 39.8 mpg. The mark 2 C5 2.2 hdi 173 hp, auto is 27.4/50.4/38.7 mpg urban/extra urban/combined so if 393 has a similar driving style/conditions to ukwide, then he should get 1 or 2 mpg better for the mark 1 C5. If not done already, it is worthwhile resetting the trip computer before a run by holding in the button on the end of the wiper stalk and doing long runs and urban runs to see how they compare. I would check if the turbo pipe has gone soft allowing it to balloon up but this is probably not affecting the fuel consumption unless the turbo pressure is too high which could put the car in limp mode.