Citroen C5 Fault P1336

[riceman1964]

Hi i'm new to the forum and could do with some HELP, I've recently purchased a 55 reg C5 1.8 petrol, when driving the car at low revs there is a loss of power, engine feels like its going to cut out, i bought it knowing about the fault and was told it was the camshaft sensor, I changed the camshaft sensor with an after market sensor but still no change so i changed the crank sensor but still no change, I then decided to get the car checked again and it came up with the same fault P1336 and was told to replace camshaft sensor with a citroen sensor which i did but still no change, also when i unplug cam sensor i can still drive the car with no change but when i unplug the crank sensor the car wont start, what does this mean HELP PLEASE Steve.  

[Parkesie]

Encountered this code before on a c4 was down down to the coil pack in the end. Might be worth giving one a try.

[paul.h]

If you go for the coil pack, I replaced one on our C3 last year, it did not seem to be giving any problems but the metal terminals that contact the tops of the spark plugs had corroded, so something you can easily check. New spark plugs may also help a new coil.

 

After a quick look on the internet, it may also pay to check the ecu connectors for any corrosion as well as the cam sensor wiring/connector.

[riceman1964]

Encountered this code before on a c4 was down down to the coil pack in the end. Might be worth giving one a try.

Hi parkesie thanks for reply i will give it a go.

[riceman1964]

If you go for the coil pack, I replaced one on our C3 last year, it did not seem to be giving any problems but the metal terminals that contact the tops of the spark plugs had corroded, so something you can easily check. New spark plugs may also help a new coil.

 

After a quick look on the internet, it may also pay to check the ecu connectors for any corrosion as well as the cam sensor wiring/connector.

Hi paul.h thanks for reply i will check connectors cheers.

[Parkesie]

How you getting on with the c5 riceman?

[riceman1964]

hi parkesie not sorted it out yet, I had the coil pack checked and that's ok I've since been told to try the EGR valve but just need to locate it? will keep you posted..

[paul.h]

According to the Haynes manual, the egr valve is located on the front left hand side of the cylinder head (gearbox end). To remove it Haynes says to remove the engine cover, disconnect the egr valve wiring plug, release the egr valve to inlet manifold pipe clamp, undo the 2 nuts and pull the valve out and recover the gasket which should be renewed.

 

The egr valve may just need cleaning.

[riceman1964]

hi paul.h cheers for your reply I've removed the engine cover and the air intake assembly but still no sign of an EGR valve, I looked on ebay just to see what they look like but can not see anything that resembles an EGR valve.

[paul.h]

On the photo in Haynes, the egr valve is at the front left top corner of the cylinder head with a cylindrical dome cover on it and an electrical connector. If the valve is missing then possibly it has been removed and a blanking plate installed.  There is a picture of one here http://www.amazon.co.uk/Fuel-Parts-EGR107-EGR-Valve/dp/B0088CAP4I

[riceman1964]

hi paul.h cheers for the info i'll have another look tomorrow.

[riceman1964]

Hello again ok the story so far - i purchased this C5 with the fault but thought is was an easy fix just replace the sensor, how naive! As the fault code is P1336 (crank/camshaft sensor) I started by replacing the crank sensor £25 but no change, I then replaced the the camshaft sensor £35 (after market part) but no change, I then had another mechanic test it, he got the code P1336 and told me to change the camshaft sensor, i told him i had which he replied "some cars don't like after market parts" so i purchased a original citroen camshaft sensor £75 but no change, then talking to another mechanic he told me to try the EGR valve which after a lot of searching i found out my model does not have one, another mechanic told me to try cleaning out the throttle body which i have with clutch cleaner but no change.So where do i go from here the car at low revs (under 2000)  loses power i have to put my foot on the clutch get the revs up then release the clutch and if i'm lucky away i go, some times its worse than others, its annoying when pulling away from lights, the light change and no power, also using lots of fuel as revving car all the time..May be time to go to the big crusher in the sky, i don't want to take it to citroen and pay out lots of money..... very frustrated first and last citroen i think!!!!!!!

so just to summarise - coil pack fine, injectors fine, sensors changed, no EGR valve, throttle body cleaned. lambda sensors fine. ???????  

[paul.h]

Before replacing any parts, I think you would be best to get a Citroen diagnostic check, other wise just replacing parts as you have found will cost more until the problem is found. However, the following are some things to consider:

 

- How many miles has the car done ?

- When you checked the injectors was this doing a flow check ?

- You could check service items like spark plugs and the air filter in case they need replacing and also for any air leaks in the air filter to manifold ducting and in any hoses on sensors. 

- You could check if the accelerator pedal cable has excess free play in it and needs adjusting. A diagnostic check would be needed to see if the electronic side of it is ok.

- Is it using any oil which could indicate a worn engine ? You could consider a compression test but the spark plug colour would probably indicate if there was a valve seating problem.

- You could also check the engine timing in case the belt has jumped or if replaced it was not installed properly.

- It has hydraulic tappets so unless they are noisy these are probably ok.

- The air flow is measured using a MAP sensor on the front of the inlet manifold so you could see if this is blocked up with oil/carbon.

- To check the inlet air temperature sensor (on the throttle housing) would need a diagnostic check. Similarly the engine coolant temperature.

 

To check what parts your car has you could look at the Citroen parts diagrams using your VIN (VIS) if you register on the service.citroen site as another professional and a member of the CItroen Owners Club http://service.citroen.com/do/changerParametres

[riceman1964]

Hi paul.h i've had a compression test done all cylinders have very good compression, the car has done 85000 miles, i've not had citroen do a diagnostic test but had three done by different mechanics and they all came back with same fault (P1336), the car ticks over lovely so the timing is fine, it feels like the engine is being starved of either air or fuel at low revs when the accelerator is pressed, also when i checked the injectors i unplugged one at a time with the engine running and each time there was a difference in the engine so i took it that the injectors were fine.   I may try putting redex in a full tank to see if anything needs cleaning. cheers....riceman

[riceman1964]

Hi paul.h the throttle is electronic not cable so maybe could be failing on the electronic side cheers.....steve

[paul.h]

Haynes did say some cars have a cable but others may be electronic. I replaced the electric pedal on our 2003 C3 since it did not smoothly increase in revs as it was gradually pressed from tickover and made setting off difficult - you could watch your rev counter to see if with the car stationary the revs can be increased smoothly.

[coastline taxis]

\whats happening here is your listening to too many people. the camshaft sensor should of been checked with a multimeter to see if it was working b4 replacing it most people with a scanner automaticly replace a sensor when they throw a fault up when in fact they are working well and reporting the fault to you. your symptoms definatley point toward the cam sensor.

 

your next step is to check the wiring that feeds the cam sensor and i dont mean a look at the bits you can see. unless you can find pin data for your car youl have to do it the hard way.  each wire going into the cam sensor has a number printed on it. now go to the multiplugs that go into the ecu and one of them wires will have the same number on it. get a multimeter and set it for continuity and put one end in the ecu multiplug and the other at the cam sensor end and check the results. other areas to have a quick check are the inlet manifold for leaks ( try tightening the bolts) also the exhaust for holes i doubt its any of thees 2 but it just rules them out. if the wires turn out ok then remove the timming cover and check the camshaft sprocket for any damage and get back to us

[riceman1964]

Hi parksie, paul.h and coastline taxis i've just been out and checked the car with a multimeter and there is a 5 volt reading across the cam sensor plug i've also checked the inlet manifold, no cracks and all bolts tight, also when car is stationary the revs goes up nice and smooth, its just when pulling away.cheers...riceman 

[coastline taxis]

Check the wiring as yes youve got voltage going into the sensor and coming out of the sensor. Bur without checking the return wire to the ecu you have no way of knowing if the signal is getting to the ecu

[riceman1964]

Hi coastline taxis i've had a look at the car today and checked the wiring and i have continuity on all three wires from cam sensor to the ECU.  

[coastline taxis]

ok then next is to take the timing covers of and check the following

 

camshaft sprocket for signs of damage and wear.

next check for signs of the timing belt stretching. using the correct timing pins time the engine up and check for slack in the belt. i know its time consuming and a pain in the rear but you have to rule these things out

[riceman1964]

Hi coastline a few more things for me to try cheers..

[madmadmax]

you are all missing the clutch switch which could cause this

[riceman1964]

Hi madmadmax what does the clutch switch do and where do i find it....