Esp

[lab44]

Anyone know why on both the coupe and hatchback (VTR/VTR+ / SX/VTR+) ESP comes as standard on the diesel models but is an option on the petrol?

 

Is it just the fact the diesals cost so much more that they could afford to put it on them but no the petrol models?

[Mike5483]

Maybe its cause of the big oomph of torque you get at low revs.

 

I have ESP on my car, when I turn it off, a light comes on the dash, but If I go above a certain speed (30MPH I think) the light goes off and the ESP comes back on.

 

Is this right???

[Mat]

Anyone know why on both the coupe and hatchback (VTR/VTR+ / SX/VTR+) ESP comes as standard on the diesel models but is an option on the petrol?

 

Is it just the fact the diesals cost so much more that they could afford to put it on them but no the petrol models?

Cos we're better drivers and dont need electronic gadgets to help us drive B)

[lab44]

lol thats a good point matt (not at all cos I'm too poor to afford the £400 add on option) :P

[lee_marshuk]

@Mike5483 - you're absolutely right! :P

[wozza]

It's cause of the low down torque. But meh not bothered about that kind of thing id still want it turned of as well as the traction control if i had them dont like that kind of thing prefer my foot over the computer as well sometimes they have a habit of causing problems as well.

[lee_marshuk]

Hehe, I knew there would come a point where you n me would have different opinions on something, wozza!

 

Have a look at this:

 

http://www.whatcar.com/news-article.aspx?NA=219916

 

I can honestly say I would never now have a car without ESP - even in the 9,000 miles I've had the C4, I reckon its saved me from 2 potentially serious incidents already.

 

Each to his own though mate!

[wozza]

There good for every day driving but i like to throw my car around a bit and if i couldnt turn it off would do my head in.

 

I know with that i wouldnt be able to get the back end twitching as much etc which is how i like it when im giving the car some abuse.

 

In most conditions though i have to admit they do offer improved safety but if people drove better to begin with its less likely they would get into the kind of incident where these things are needed. ESP is really only there to stop you from spinning out etc by applying power to 1 wheel and cutting it to others etc.

 

Good throttle control and good car control and knowing your own abilities will stop that anyways in my opinion.

 

And you agree with most of what else i say normally you must be a little mental me thinks no one would find what i say right unless there mad!

[lee_marshuk]

Lol!! Agreed!!

 

Oh yeah you're right mate. Both of the two times I mentioned were caused by a woman doing summert stupid. (no sexism intended). I think really the only time you can ever say something like esp has to be used and its not human error is if you get thrown into a skid by some ice or something.

 

Sometimes I wish people would drive as though they've got no safety extras at all i.e. a bit more carefully!! That way when the safety has to be used its more effective.

 

Problem is there are a lot of a*****les out there who, frankly, need to learn to drive!

[wozza]

Agreed. I only push my car so much I can feel im getting on the limits of the car though when I have driven it a little too hard.

 

But yup had a few ABS type moments couple times in the C4 due to people cutting in front of me while im next to them they just check there mirrors and see nothing there but forget to check there blindspot and as a result you get people turning into you etc.

 

Just lack of judgment. And people usually having terrible lane discipline like at round abouts people always go into the right hand lane to go straight on etc. The right lane is for turning right left is for left and straight on its not a hard thing to remember.

[lab44]

I agree with wozza - people should rarely need to use these features if they drove properly in the first place. Anyone frequently using the ABS / ESP probably is'nt driving properly in the first place.

 

I have never had ABS on any of my cars (apart from my C4) and in that time it would have only been useful once when I breaked to avoid a car pulling out of a junction and skidded on the wet road (but then again I admit I was travelling too fast for the conditions and that taught me a lesson for the future).

 

On the other hand though I think its best to know how to drive without these features we all make mistakes and therefore ABS ESP, etc can often be the difference between having an accident and not. However if your ABS/ESP is constantly kicking in then its almost certain you are driving too close to people, and/or too fast.

[lee_marshuk]

@Lab44 - absolutely agreed!

 

Don't get me started on roundabouts mate!!! we've got this one by me, where they even paint continuous lanes round the roundabout - u know the sort where u go in the right hand lane, and the lanes actually paint and curve round the island so u know exactly where to go? number of people who go from far left and take the furthest right exit....bah!

[lab44]

most people dont seem to know how to use roundabouts. Worst offenders though are old people - i was half way round the roundabout yesterday when some old bugger in a smokey old volvo thought he would pull out in front of me. It then took him about an hour to accelerate upto the 60mph speed limit blowing black smoke all over my nice new car by which time he had hit a 40 limit which he continued through at about 50. grrrr :D

[bill03]

Worst offenders though are old people

 

For every old duffer you can quote I can quote a just as stupid young one..

[lee_marshuk]

yer.....old duffers n young whippersnappers eh :D all in all, i reckon everyone should be banned....except for us, of course :P

[lab44]

Plenty of bad drivers of all ages. Though I do think we should all be retested on a regular basis say every 10 years of so to keep upto date. Of course I am a good driver and will never need retesting and any accidents will always be someone elses fault :D

[lee_marshuk]

oh ur the same as me?? wow :(

[Mat]

Though I do think we should all be retested on a regular basis say every 10 years of so to keep upto date.

Here here.

 

Maybe it should/could be implemented as a voluntary thing. Those that pass get a discount on their tax (not likely under this government) or insurance (more likely).

[hertsnminds]

Rather than just a retest how about trying to give people some advanced driving skills at the same time. Or even better tell them how the things like ESP and ABS should be used.

 

In normal driving conditions most people would never know what difference all of the safety devices make to driving.

 

Ian

Black 55 VTR+

[lab44]

Yeah it would be useful. I'm currently thinking of taking some type of advanced driving course at the moment. I think more people should be encouraged how to drive "properly" rather than just passing a test at 17 and that being it. For example knowing how to use the proper gearing to keep to the speed limit, what to do in the event of a skid etc..

 

I like to think I am a fairly good driver but on the other hand there are so many things I dont know that I either wasnt taught in my test or I have simply forgotton.

[wozza]

I plan to do my IAM soon moving home so will have a bit of money and would like to basically learn to drive on the roads properly im a good driver but the IAM way apparently teaches you to drive rather differently.

 

Then i wouldnt mind doing some track lessons learning how to handle cars at speed properly etc.

[lab44]

Yeah from what I have heard the IAM is good for learning how to drive "properly" ie. checking your mirrors, selecting the right gear, keeping to the speed limits but may not teach you the more advanced stuff like how to handle fast corners, skid control and so on.

 

I think I might start with an IAM course to get my basic skills such as observation upto scratch but would also like to learn the more fun and advanced stuff too as I certainly think it can be useful on the road - eg. what would you actually do if you got into a skid or met an oncoming car in the middle of the road and had to swerve to avoid it.

[wozza]

Depends on the type of skid if its wet icey etc to what you shoudl do. Basic thing is though you steer into the skid so if your skidding left you turn left it will bring the car back into a straight line which you can then adjust. basically your then in control so its more a controlled drift than a skid. Will keep the front wheels where you want them to go and the back end should follow shortly afterwards.

[Mat]

Just remember to do the reverse in a rear-drive car, eg most BMWs

[wozza]

No you still turn into the skid or you will cause the car to oversteer even more. resulting in you completely losing control.