4 Year Old C3 Cannot Be Repaired!

[AlanFC]

Well, my C3 has been at the dealer for almost a month now.........and they still can't find out what is causing the problem with it.

 

I am extremely cheesed off (substitute the worst expletive you can imagine in the previous sentence).

 

What a ridiculously unbeleivable set of affairs.

 

Basically Citroen cannot repair a 3yr 10 month car with 55K miles, serviced by the book, always using fully synthetic oil, always using shell diesel. the car has been off the road for a month.

 

The garage still has the car.

 

Let this be a warning to all of you, get rid of your C3 before the warranty runs out or take out a comprehensive extended warranty, thinking about it.....whats the point anyway if Citroen do not have the expertise to fix their own products?

 

Get rid it and buy yourself a Nissan Micra or a Toyota Yaris

 

If you think I am exagerrating or making this up for some warped reason, I will be happy to substantiate what I am saying in whatever manner you wish.

 

If there are any motoring journos out there who can put the squeeze on Citroen, please let me know because i really don't know what else to do.

[iannez]

ring your dealer tomorrow and tell them that you would be more than happy to pay for them to renew one component at a time untill it is fixed. this way they will save you on labour costs and should only cost you a few grand in parts. you must not know this but citroen dont have your car. its a franchise run garage that sell citroens. franchise techs do not design and build citroens.

 

"If you think I am exagerrating or making this up for some warped reason, I will be happy to substantiate what I am saying in whatever manner you wish."

 

what an earth is that supposed to mean. sounds to me like you want to beat someone up

and if thats the attitude you are going into the garage with they will most probs be just pi**ing you about deliberately. nowhere in your rant have you said what the problem is with your car. you have clearly come on here to complain about it. always happy to help if i can but have no time for whingers or ppl who talk tough on forums. bye bye sad guy.

[AlanFC]

ring your dealer tomorrow and tell them that you would be more than happy to pay for them to renew one component at a time untill it is fixed. this way they will save you on labour costs and should only cost you a few grand in parts. you must not know this but citroen dont have your car. its a franchise run garage that sell citroens. franchise techs do not design and build citroens.

 

"If you think I am exagerrating or making this up for some warped reason, I will be happy to substantiate what I am saying in whatever manner you wish."

 

what an earth is that supposed to mean. sounds to me like you want to beat someone up

and if thats the attitude you are going into the garage with they will most probs be just pi**ing you about deliberately. nowhere in your rant have you said what the problem is with your car. you have clearly come on here to complain about it. always happy to help if i can but have no time for whingers or ppl who talk tough on forums. bye bye sad guy.

 

Thanks for your useful reply jannez, a classic case of engage brain before opening mouth. There is only one 'Alanfc' on this site so you can quite clearly see that I have detailed the problem with this car on another thread. I hope you end up with the same hassles with your car as I have with mine, then perhaps I can learn from you how to deal with this major problem effectively.

 

Oh, and for the benefit of your own education, you may wish to look up the definition of the words 'rant' and 'whinge'......bye, bye.

[flitwick]

Thanks for your useful reply jannez, a classic case of engage brain before opening mouth. There is only one 'Alanfc' on this site so you can quite clearly see that I have detailed the problem with this car on another thread. I hope you end up with the same hassles with your car as I have with mine, then perhaps I can learn from you how to deal with this major problem effectively.

 

Oh, and for the benefit of your own education, you may wish to look up the definition of the words 'rant' and 'whinge'......bye, bye.

Im sorry to hear your problems its c**p if the main dealer cant sort out your problem it may be worth getting a second opion i had alot of trouble with mine and the main dealer couldnt find out what the probs were .took it to a inderpendant and after a couple of trips sorted it out (Leak of water onto the electric cabling) its shocking how Citroen get away with things like this but i dont think its just citroen ive had the same with Ford vauxhall honda and pug so im of the opion that for all the tech that they put into new cars they arnt training the staff to deal with it good luck

[iannez]

if thats the case why create a new thread. if this did happen to me unlike you i understand how complex these cars can be and that every now and again a problem does arise that can be a pain to find. for your education look up multiplexing and see if you can work out how it works. not just a case of checking resistance or voltage. then you have ecu's which are coded to the car so if this does not fix it its not just a case of refitting the old one and putting the new one back on the shelf as once its coded to a car it will only work on that car. anyway all i am trying to say is try and be a bit more understanding and patient. think about it like this. your car is out of warrentey so the garage is under no pressure from citroen uk to fix it and could tell you to take your car elsewhere any time they want. in my experience if a costomer is friendley and understanding they get more. shouting the odds will get you no where. asking for some car mag journo (as you put it) to get involved will do you no favours at all as there would not be a garage anywhere would touch one of your cars again.

all this aside i honestley hope you get it sorted but think you would benefit alot from a diffrent approach.

[iannez]

and flitwick. when will ppl understand we are not citroen staff. we are normal mechanics that work in a garage with a citroen sign out the front and have the difficult job of fixing one of the most complicated makes of car on the planet. if training was the case there would never be anyone hear to fix your cars as they would constantley be away on courses. when a car has a nightmare of a problem we call citroen uk and get advice from one of there techs that is citroen staff that has access to much more info than us. franchise dealers are not owned by citroen and have nothing to do with designing, building and testing of citroen cars and we can only do our best to fix them.

[flitwick]

Im not claiming anyone works for citroen but i do know people who have in the past and i m on first name with the service guys at my garage ( so many visits) they all used to work for marshalls in bedford before it closed down .Most of these guys have worked on citroen cars for years and all go out on training courses for when citroen bring out new cars at slough and he even said that citroen uk rely to heaverly on there computer diagnosies equipment which is why i surgested that allan fc got a second opion ive nothing against independant repairs in fact if i wanted a second opion on something thats one place to start .

My point was that its a fact we expect alot more out of our cars than say 10 years ago if you had a problem it was fixed end of story but having to take a car back again and again and then they dont know how to fix is very poor considering its only 4 years old

And after the amount of problems ive had with mine ive got good reason not to be happy with citroen uk

[AlanFC]

The latest development is that the dealer cannot repair the car, this car as I said has been well looked after and ran fine without a peep for 3 years 8 months and 55,000 miles.oh, and the heap of junk cost me £10,000 when I bought it, hows that for depreciation, £10,000 to heap of junk in 3 years 8 months? R.I.P.

 

It now cannot be repaired after being with the dealer for 7 weeks, how unbeleivable is that? They have spent over 20 hours fault finding and still cannot find the cause of the problem.

 

The sales manager is working out a deal for me to replace it with something else, I can't say anymore as I have yet to speak with him. I'll let you know the outcome. Certainly, I will say that I believe the service manager has done the best of his ability to try to fix it.

 

Again, I will reiterate what I said, do not keep these cars beyond the 3 year warranty period, better still don't buy one in the first place and save yourself the pain that I am going through. Had you asked me what I thought of my C3 before this problem began I would have recommended it but what with other owners who have had to change fuel injectors prematurely at a rip off £400 a pop, it is clear that these 'economical' cars are anything but. Ford had a lucky escape not putting these engines into their models.

 

Get rid of yours now, do not be 'seduced' as I was by trouble-free running, it is a false sense of security.

 

Boy, am I mightily cheesed off by all this! Any apologists for this piece of junk...save your breath, the facts are as you have just read them and as they appear in my other posts.

 

For those out there who have classed me as a whinger, let me educate you.......a whinger is one who moans and complains without a legitimate reason...work it out for yourselves.

 

I can't believe that there are people out there who buy cars like these at auction, very brave indeed.

[iannez]

alan. i was not having a pop at you for slating the car mate. it was for slating the mechanics trying to fix your car. i work on these day in day out so i know better than most people what there like. we have to deal with citroen uk almost every day and belive me, there a nightmare. i can understand why your upset but all i was trying to say was dont blame the people trying to help you.

[raveydavey]

It is a principle of law that a guarantee (or warranty in this case) period is not a "cop out" for a manufacturer to avoid intervening after that period has expired. The goods (ie the car) should be expected to provide usable service for a reasonable length of time.

 

It could be argued, I'm sure, that you should not expect to have to replace the injectors on a four year old / 55k car, especially if you can show that the manufacturers recommended service schedule has been followed.

 

Of course, what the likes of Citroen depend upon is that not many people know this and as individuals it is a lot of effort and cost to take something like this through the courts. Have you considered getting a specialist independent engineers report on the car? It might cost you £100 or so but it could be money well spent.

[AlanFC]

Thanks very much for your constructive suggestion raveydavey but to be honest I don't think I particularly wish to see this heap of junk again. I will be driving it with baited breath waiting for a fuel injector to fail on me next, like poor old akf or some other major component.

 

jannez,....I really am at a loss, maybe I've got selective vision but I can't see anywhere where I have taken a pop at the mechanics working on my car. All I have stated is that it is beyond their abilities and expertise to repair it. Which clearly it is otherwise I would be happily behind the wheel by now!

[Guest CE05LDB]

I remember my neighbours daughter had a People Carrier a Chrysler I think. Well anyway it was breaking down and it was out of warranty. They took it to the local Garage. They Couldn't do it. So it was taken to a dealer. After so long of having the car the dealer couldn't find the cause. So in the end Chrysler sent one of their specialists from America to sort it out and he did finally sort it out.

[AlanFC]

Well, well guess what has turned up outside my house?..............yep it's my C3, all repaired and all singing and dancing!

 

The dealers managed to find out what the problem(s) was.

 

The initial starting problem was cured by an ecu change, after 4 weeks of investigation. Then straight away it would not rev above 3,000 rpm and the engine management light kept coming on. This second fault was cured by replacing a 4-way vacuum valve that sits at the back of the engine,(I think he said) after another 4 weeks of investigation during which the dealer kindly gave me a courtesy car (my car is out of warranty, but I am a long standing customer)

 

I do not know if the second problem arose as a consequence of the first, it seems odd that it should go when it did.

So effectively my car had been off the road for around 2 months. How painful.

 

Now that it is back my wife (it's actually her car) does not want to change it for a boring (reliable) japanese model no matter how I try to convince her.....I am still trying believe me!

 

If I lose, I reckon it has to have a Warranty Direct, warranty to calm my nerves until the next major component goes, around this mileage I expect the good 'ole fuel injectors will start giving up. (£400 a pop).

 

I will say (again) that I believe that the dealership tried to the best of their ability to sort it out and eventually got there, (2 months). I have no doubt that they were as cheesed off by it as I was. CitroenUK were involved including some 3rd party help I got from the press for which I am very grateful. I received the car in perfect working order F.O.C. (for my inconvenience I imagine). If this is CitroenUKs new face of customer service, I can only say that I am impressed and thanks very much to the dealership for being so persistent. It has been a rough and strained couple of months for all involved.

 

Thanks to all who have given their constructive comments and I hope if any of you experience the same type of faults as I have, that this post may help in troubleshooting so your car isn't off the road for 2 months.

[raveydavey]

Shop around for a warranty if you are keeping the car - try www.autotrader.co.uk who list loads on their website.

 

Bear in mind that most will want you to keep to the manufacturers stated service schedule at a recognised garage by a qualified person - typically this means a proper VAT registered garage.

 

Also bear in mind that if you're paying £20 a month for a warranty that is £240 a year on top of all your other running costs - you have to weigh up if that is worth it. You may appreciate the piece of mind given past problems.

 

Read the small print, make sure you have the appropriate level of cover - I have seen warranties with a limit of £250 which doesn't cover a lot these days. Also bear in mind that whatever is going wrong will have to fail before they will get involved. Just because something is noisy / about to go doesn't mean they will pay for it fixing - it will have to fail first. Not very convienient f you're on a touring holiday of the Western Isles.

 

Finally note that some warranty companies will expect you to settle the bill and then claim it back from them and their is usually an excess for you to pay. Not all garages will deal direct with all warranty companies too.

[kfk]

Good advice.......put simply, the 'Extended Warranties you can purchase are a mechanical breakdown policy, they do not cover adjustments, service items or wear and tear.

 

You, the customer are responsible for all stripping costs/investigation/diagnosis. When repair is known has to be reported to warranty company before reassembly. Warranty company may arrange to send an engineer before repair commences.

 

Assuming they authorise the repair you may find they only pay £35 per hour labour rate...so you end up paying the difference.

 

You mention injectors.......so assuming you have a problem with injectors, its unlikely they would pay for a set, after all they will breakdown one at a time.

 

It wont cover consequential damage.......so assuming you have a coolant leak, pipes & radiator wont be covered due them being listed in excluded items, (interestingly the heater matrix might be covered providing the cause of failure isnt corrosion), your failed head gasket also wouldnt be covered......either because they will prove its consequential/lack of maintenance/driver error......how many lights do you need to come on before you will stop!

 

Summing up.....lookat the policy.......if its a listed parts policy check the parts listed, also check excluded parts

 

And a tip for anyone with an extended warranty, when you have a problem book it in immediately for that problem and that alone......dont think about the other half dozen jobs youve been meaning to get looked at under the warranty.

 

Mechanical breakdown generally means something has stopped working or is working incorrectly and can be demonstrated to be faulty.

 

If you put a claim in for several unrelated repairs and are unable to demostrate the fault you can guarantee the warranty company will try to wriggle out.

[hertsnminds]

I am very wary of extended warranties since my experience with a Citroen BX and an ABS fault.

 

My ABS light came on and I took the car in for repair. The garage diagnosed an ABS valve block issue and replaced it under the warranty. I then got the car back and the ABS light was still coming on. The garage then diagnosed a new ABS computer.

 

The warranty company claimed the 2 items were part of the same fault and would only pay for 1 of the repairs. I argued that they were 2 separate faults but they only paid half of the 2nd more expensive ABS computer replacement. I had no choice but to get the work done or the car would have filaed its MOT.

 

So as with all things buyer beware.

 

Ian

Black 55 VTR+