C8 Workshop Manual

[gecko1001]

Hi

I am just wondering which is the best workshop manual to buy for the C8 HDI 2.0 sx, i used to use the Peter Russex Manual and a disk manual for my old Fiat Ulysee, so probably thinking something similar, any opinions on this one please http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Citroen-C8-Workshop-Service-Repair-Manual-1994-2013-Wiring-diagrams-/322105759949?_trksid=p2141725.m3641.l6368

And also this one http://www.emanualonline.com/Cars/Citroen/Citroen-C8-Workshop-Repair-And-Service-Manual.html or any better suggestions.

[paul.h]

The ebay one seems to be the Citroen service box which normally comes on 3 dvds to install on your computer. This includes the workshop manuals for all Citroens, the parts diagrams and wiring diagrams. The service box is the best one to get and you could just search for that to find alternative suppliers.

[Simple]

This is the nearest equivalent to a Haynes Manual, but in French:
https://mega.nz/#!chl0SZyQ!7DD8gfkK-kwnScq9JRcvx0j_MxPlYNrfTY20WPYYtFY
 
And this is the Citroen Service Box Multilingual, you can also trace components when you click on diagrams..

Citroen Service Box (DocBackup + Sedre) (11.2013).torrent.zip

 

p.s. If you install on Windows XP, ensure that Internet Explorer 8 is installed..

Edited May 18, 2016 by Simple

[gecko1001]

I got this one in the end https://downloadworkshopmanuals.com/index.php/citroen but got to say it does not seem as good as an HTML one I had for my old Ulysee 

[paul.h]

How big was the file to download and how long did it take ?

[gecko1001]

it is 17.8 gigs and downloaded while in bed, it runs on a virtual machine.

[jonnie45]

it is 17.8 gigs and downloaded while in bed, it runs on a virtual machine.

 

Hi,

 

I have been looking into buying this.

 

I was a bit confused with all the talk of a virtual machine but I have since wondered if what people are really talking about is a local server - for those who dont know the difference, usually your web browser communicates with a web based server that is located anywhere in the world. A local server sits on your machine but is a software emulation of a regular web server - example XAMPP

 

I use a local server to develop websites so that I can see the website working on my machine but I dont have to be connected to the internet all the time. On my machine sits all the images, databases and code that usually constitute a remote website and the virtual server allows me to see the website running on my  browser just as if I were connected to the internet and the website was actually hosted at a remote location. It boils down to sticking a load of stuff in a directory on your own machine and getting it to appear as a website.

 

A virtual machine would entail a whole lot more, generally this involves software emulation of a different operating system and hardware, software writers use this kind of thing to see how their software will work say on a MAC when they have written the software for a PC - usually its not without its difficulties hence my initial concern - even as an ex IT pro of twenty years experience I still pull my hair out at the unwanted and uninvited upgrade to Win10 and I dont need extra cabbage in my stew right now.

 

I am guessing that the entire workshop manual is effectively just one giant website and database package but arranged to sit on your machine.

 

I am happy to install local servers on my computer I aready run XAMPP but I would need re--assurances installing a virtual machine because it usually involves more fundamental changes.

 

Jonnie

Edited August 17, 2016 by jonnie45

[Simple]

Rest assured it is so simple and free nowadays. The choice is quite wide (including Windows own Hyper-V), but the best and most widely used are:

 

*- VMware Workstation Player (~70 mb) https://my.vmware.com/en/web/vmware/free#desktop_end_user_computing/vmware_workstation_player/12_0

*- Oracle VirtualBox (~120 mb) https://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Downloads (most popular, fast and regularly updated)

 

VM is usually installed on a notebook or desktop running 64 bit operating system with 4 GB RAM or more and lots of hard disk space (you may need to allocate 36 GB)

 

The process:

1- Download and install the VMware Player or VirtualBox (VBox requires Extension Pack to support USB etc)

2- Run VM and create the Virtual Hardware, (Basically OS type, Hard disk space 24+ GB, 1.5 to 3 GB Ram and 1 or 2 CPU cores)

3- Mount Windows XP or 7, 32bit ISO and start the VM to commence installation.

* VBox.. Menu --> Settings --> Storage --> under storage tree Choose the CD --> under Attributes choose the CD icon --> choose Virtual optical disk file.. and point it to Windows 7/XP ISO file.

* VMplayer.. Menu --> VM --> Settings --> under Hardware tab choose CD/DVD --> under Connection, click on "use ISO image file" and click Browse --> Navigate to your Windows 7/XP ISO 

4- Install the VMware Tools for Player or Gust Additions for VBox (from Windows session, these are the drivers),

* From VBox menu, while in Windows session, click on Devices --> Insert Guest Additions CD image.. (run from CD if it does not start automatically)

* From VMware Player menu , while in Windows session.. Click on VM --> Install VMware Tools (run from CD if it does not start automatically)

 

Note:Some software requires IDE hard disk type to run, this is usually done automatically with Windows XP Ensure you choose IDE type for Windows 7.

 

If you wish to change the HD type at a later stage, delete the VM without deleting the HD, create a new VM with IDE type HD but do not create a new HD, use existing HD and point it to the readily available HD..

 

Mount the CD of your software and install it as usual (if using XP, Install .NET 3.5 and Internet Explorer 8). 

 

p.s. To enable USB devices in VBox, Settings ->> USB --> Under Enable USB Controller Choose 2.0 --> under USB device filters choose the icon with a blue dot for general devices and the icon with  + for a specific device.

 

Done, Simple.

Edited August 17, 2016 by Simple

[jonnie45]

Rest assured it is so simple and free nowadays. The choice is quite wide (including Windows own Hyper-V), but the best and most widely used are:

 

*- VMware Workstation Player (~70 mb) https://my.vmware.com/en/web/vmware/free#desktop_end_user_computing/vmware_workstation_player/12_0

*- Oracle VirtualBox (~120 mb) https://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Downloads (most popular, fast and regularly updated)

 

Hi

 

Thanks I went ahead and downloaded, I also realised my naivety in thinking it would work using a transparent local server such as XAMPP because

either Citroen or the people selling the download will not want people to have access to the source code and Database so they have chosen

to wrap it up in vmware.

 

Overall I think for a tenner its a very good buy.

I accept the commercial reasons for wrapping it in vmware but is source control was not the issue then it would have so much better been done using a local server - XAMMP is fast - its faster than many servers online - vmware on the other hand makes my i7 machine chug along at speeds I have not seen for a very long time and god that "torch" showing an empty directory is back -  I am glad I did not install on my slow laptop!

 

In addition hardware such as printers is a pain - I will spend time looking into it in greater detail at a later time and made

do with a work around for the time being as my focus is the car not the software - basically I go into XP mode save out the information and then return to windows10 to print or look at.

 

There are improvements that could be made, for instance the instructions for one task will often include sub tasks that are detailed elsewhere, you would think that lines such as "Remove the catalytic converter and particle filter assembly" under the instructions for removing a turbo would actually be a link to that subtask but no you have to navigate back to the main menu and find it yourself - decent database design would deliver that kind of thing almost as a by product.

 

Its slow, its clunky and antiquated (XP) - as a twenty year IT veteran (aerospace and automotive)  I would probably sack someone if they came up with this as a solution today but that's a professional gripe and not worth getting upset about.

 

The point is it does work, it does get you the information you need and for a tenner its very good value indeed.

 

vmware does not seem to leave much footprint on the machine, I have yet to take a good look but it looks to me as if it would uninstall leaving the host machine relatively unaffected.

 

Overall very pleased just a bit of culture shock to be transported back to bits of technology I thought we had left behind, I'll get over it  ;-)

Edited August 18, 2016 by jonnie45

[Simple]

This software runs on a station at the dealers that was made in the middle ages!! and what you have is a cracked copy that is NOT for sale to customers!! and worth thousands.... PSA recently released DiagBox V8.xx which runs on the same hardware and uses the same old technologies.. This is to avoid licenses costs and other technical/legal issues.. Also their requirements are simple and the users are (usually) NOT IT literates.

 

I am sure you will be able to find your way around all the technical issues, they are not difficult. But notice that some software (like DiagBox) tries to connect a legitimate Peugeot Citroen Dealer to the Head Quarter's server (for updates etc..) and if NOT a legitimate installation, it will lock the installation.

 

By the way, I have an installation on an I7 computer, and Except for the starting (where it tries to perform certain checks!!) it is as fast as a normal hardware. I also have a number of (other software) installations on I7, I5 and AMD with Linux and Windows RS2 and I hardly notice a difference between VM and the host machine (once you pass the hardware threshold). 

 

To give an example:

I installed DiagBox 7.01 on an I5 with SSHD Laptop, VMware workstation, Win XP, 1.5 GB RAM, 16GB Hard Disk space.. installation took more than 2 hours.

 

My son performed a complete DiagBox 7.01 installation that took an amazing 4 minutes.. The platform was Windows XP 32bit SP3 with 3GB RAM allocated memory and 20GB allocated Virtual Disk space running on VirtualBox 5.0.17 r106287 on his Desktop computer which is comprised of Intel G3258 CPU at 4.0 GHz with 8GB RAM and 250GB SSD on a Z97 GigaByte motherboard. The full installation and upgrade to v7.57 took 7 minutes!!!

 

He then performed another installation with identical setup but using VMWare Player, which took 11 minutes to 7.01, 14 minutes to 7.02 and 20 minutes to reach 7.57... These were the fastest DiagBox installations I have seen.

 

My advice, check the hardware allocations.

 

Good luck, Simple.

[jonnie45]

Hi Simple

 

Ahhh actually I thought this was legit, again naively I did not think that Citroen and others would have an issue with DIYers getting access to this

information I simply thought the vmplayer was only about keeping control on the source with regards to modification or re-distribution.

 

Point taken about computers at service stations although still not a fan of the vmplayer, if source control was not an issue you would simply write (say) a PHP database driven website and use a local server on the host machine, this would enable the user to use whatever operating system and browser

combination they saw fit - that would be the simple solution, ok there are the usual issues with browser versions and non-compliance but people have that issue every time they go online and the solution lies with the user on that count. Not wishing to enter a technical tennis match just comparing a hypothetical clean solution with the actual solution. It seems counter intuitive to me to implement a local host DB website in this manner.

 

I can sympathise with car manufacturers really, amateur tinkering on a complex diesel engine will probably not deliver much joy for them so apart from profits in selling repair information they probably dont like to encourage DIY'ers.

 

On the other hand if you are like me and, have a 4 grand car and issues with turbo, ECU and possibly more then at some stage you dont fancy paying a professional even if the belief is that they will get to the root problem first time. At some stage complex cars will enter the time of their lives where DIY maintenance is the only sensible financial option and people will need some form of support. I am now considering that the next purchase will be the simplest petrol engine model I can find, not sure my conscience will allow me to resell the C5 so run it and look after it until its scrap - love the C5 but even if I get past these issues I have a feeling that the choice is to become an absolute mechanical whizz or to look around for simpler models.

 

Thank god for the web, I have reams of online advice including trade stuff regards the pitfalls and common errors in refitting a turbo including case studies of fittings that went horribly wrong - if you are like me and caught between scrapping or self fix then its all very much welcome and whilst I am 

going slowly and forensically I don't have a lot to lose right now.

[Simple]

The software developers are very clever and can write using the latest and greatest technologies, but they try to tie it to their own hardware... For example, Lexia or Diagox software will run on a laptop, but will connect to the car using PSA's OBDII device not through a generic one.. So, you still have to buy the device or a clone!! The business model that is worrying the car manufacturers is not the DIYers like you and I, it is the thousands of independent mechanics who do not want to pay dealers rates to access information and who use after market parts. 

 

Truly, thank God for the internet, it is helping people exchange information and acquire knowledge, but car manufacturers are also moving on it. They are already offering access to their servers per hour for a charge!!! I have upgraded my ECU firmware myself, I don't know how much wold the dealer charge, but I know that he charges 80 Euros to read the Error codes, while I bought my Interface for 56 Euros, and can now perform all my diagnosis, analysis and configurations..