Advise On Diesel Pump

[PaulLeonard]

Hi all

 

My Citroen c8 is in need of some help and I really want to get things sorted. Quite a few mechanics now have suggested that I go to a Diesel specialists over in Croydon to get my non-starter problems sorted out.

 

Spoke to the garage and they said that I should bring it in and to diagnose it, it will cost £80. If there is a Diesel pump problem then it will cost around £700.

 

Then I spoke to someone else and they suggested that it will be cheaper to go to......... wait for it...... FRANCE!!!

 

Was researching how much it will be to take the car and it is £15 single. What I can do is take it to a garage in France....... details please? and pitch up tent for however long it will take.

 

Any advice will be greatly appreciated

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[coastline taxis]

It would be cheaper to put a second hand engine in 9complete with pump). What fault codes/symptoms do you have

[PaulLeonard]

Hi CLT

 

You may remember to replying to my similar thread http://www.citroen-owners-club.co.uk/citroen/topic/21212-c8-starter-problems/

 

I am just so confused with the whole lot. I don't know where to start. As you may well tell; I don't have bags of money so this car is my only hope until I win the lottery!!

 

You did mention about someone in the C5 section being able to reset the ECU for free but I feel cheeky in asking.

 

At this point in time, the car is in the garage getting the clutch changed and now the thermostat housing is cracked and leaking water so they are charging me £105(cost price) plus labour for the whole new unit including thermostat

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[coastline taxis]

When you bump start it does it fire straight up.

the garage should clear the codes for you  itl cost them nothing

is yours a 8 valve or 16 valve

is your battery turning engine over fast

[PaulLeonard]

Hi CLT

 

Here are my answers to your questions

 

When you bump start it does it fire straight up. ----- yes

the garage should clear the codes for you  itl cost them nothing---- they don't have the equipment. New garage will possibly charge.

is yours a 8 valve or 16 valve---- Not sure, sorry

is your battery turning engine over fast---- Yes, except today, I had a "Battery Charge Fault" Went shopping then Easy Started it and the fault disappeared.

 

My car needs some serious help

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[paul.h]

I would still consider asking another member via a private message if they are able help with diagnostics. The worst that can happen is you will get a polite no. On the diagnostic post on the C5 section the nearest member appears to be in Bedfordshire http://www.citroen-owners-club.co.uk/citroen/topic/20345-diagnostic-help/ The easiest way to send a message is to move the mouse cursor over the member's name and then click on send message.

 

From the previous posts the engine code is RHT = DW10ATED4 with particle filter, 2.0 hdi, 16 valve, 5 speed manual gearbox, max power 79 kW (106 bhp), max torque 270 Nm, registered June 2003.

[coastline taxis]

If its firing straight up with a bump start then is not your diesel pump. Check to see if the engine is turning over fast enough Starter/battery/earth leads

[PaulLeonard]

Hi CLT

 

If it isn't the pump, then that's really good news!!

 

The engine turns over fast so it isn't the battery?

 

That "reputable" garage said that the starter was loose so they tightened that up but still won't start. The SM was replaced quite recently.

 

Earth leads i'm clueless about where to start with these, where is that located? I presume it has something to do with the battery.

 

Do you know anyone down here who might be able to give me a quick diagnostic check?

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[paul.h]

If the engine turns over fast (more than about 300 rpm) then the earth connections are probably ok and the wiring is probably ok. So if fuel is in and the engine turns over then a diesel should run. Unless maybe there is low compression in the cylinders or maybe the fuel / air ratio is wrong (injector or air flow meter or temperature sensor fault ?).

 

Have you tried the list of members who will help with a diagnostic check ?

[PaulLeonard]

Hi Paul

 

Thank you for your reply. I did contact that guy that you told me about last week. He replied to me this morning saying that he was away till the 17th July. That's fair enough but I don't think I can wait that long.

 

I don't mind the travelling so I might try someone else who might be able to help in the mean time.

 

 

Unless maybe there is low compression in the cylinders or maybe the fuel / air ratio is wrong (injector or air flow meter or temperature sensor fault ?).

 

 

Is this an easy fix or easy diagnostic?

 

I really just want this car to run smoothly (ish) over the Summer hols :)

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[paul.h]

I would like to see what coastline taxis thinks since he has a lot of experience.

 

Does the car run ok once it has started ?

[PaulLeonard]

Hi Paul

 

As this is my one and only old car; I cannot compare to any other. (Apart from the VW Sharan which was a 13 plate and drove like a dream and only had it for 3 days)

 

If I miss-gear then the car shuts down and you cannot restart it straight away. Even bump starting by going down hill doesn't work!!! I have to leave it 15 mins before I can roll it down the hill, that is if I broke down on one!!! If not, I have to get that easy start just to start it again.

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[coastline taxis]

Right dont be going in a huff or out like that but your going to get told off. Think carfully before you answer a question as it can point things in the wrong direction. Asked you if it started with a bump start and you said yes your last post says it dosnt. Its important as theres 2 different answers.

 

so lets start again

 

When the engine is cold does it start up straight away  both of the key and with a bump start or does it just do in when its warmed up. when it does start  is it instant or does it wind itself up and eventually fire up and what colour smoke (if any) comes out the exhaust.

 

try to give as much info as possible please

[PaulLeonard]

So sorry all

 

I will start again from the beginning

 

When the engine is cold, it doesn't start up. There is no pre-heater light coming on either :(

When the engine is hot, it doesn't start up. No pre-heater light again.

 

If I have the chance to park the car at my favourite spot (on the hill round the corner to my house) then I will. For my own vehicles security, I would rather it be parked outside my house.

 

No smoke comes out as far as I am aware.

 

I didn't mean to sound like I was in a huff. Just annoying that I cannot start it the usual way most people do. :)

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[coastline taxis]

Ok thats much easier to answer for what you need to check order one of theese of ebay and it will sort you out

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-OBD2-ELM327-V1-5-Bluetooth-Car-Scanner-Android-Torque-Auto-Scan-Tool-OBD-II-/111088326026?pt=UK_Diagnostic_Tools_Equipment&hash=item19dd61558a

 

You need to check the crankshaft and camshaft sensors as these will stop the engine from starting

[PaulLeonard]

Hi CLT

 

Thank you for the info of the purchase. Unfortunately it doesn't work for Diesel engines.

 

How can I check the crankshaft and camshaft sensors? Is it a DIY job or garage job?

 

I was just thinking, when the garage replaced the glow plugs months ago; they said it was a tricky job in getting them out as there was rust so they lubricated them to get them out. Could they of pulled a fast one and only replaced a couple of them? Or can they really of burnt out again. 

 

Hopefully I can do the crankshaft and camshaft sensors :)

 

Paul

[paul.h]

I am not sure  but if the crank sensor is working when the engine is turned over on the starter it may show the engine rpm on the rev counter. If the cam and crank sensors need replacing they are about £25 to £30 each - if you have to pay somebody to check them it is lower cost to just replace them yourself - unless it turns out they are not the problem in which case the money could have been used for a diagnostic check at a Citroen dealer. When a cam sensor failed on our C3 petrol it lit up the engine management light and gave a fault code so I knew what the problem was. However, I have read that fault codes are not always given when these sensors fail.

 

One thing when looking at low cost code readers, since your car is a 2003 diesel it may not work with all code readers since OBD compliance was not needed until 2004 for diesels.

[coastline taxis]

the elm unit is what we started with as we wernt to sure and belive me It works for diesels weve used them in the past. at £6 it a very cheap entry into obd And yours is obd.compliant.  Without diagnostic support it is going to cost you a lot of money to find this fault. it could be anything from a loose wire to a knackered engine. but anyway here goes

 

http://www.ehow.com/way_5471047_do-check-crankshaft-position-sensor.html

 

theres one there for the camshaft aswell.  test them and let us know the results please

[paul.h]

This may also help when you check the cam and crank sensors:

 

On our C3 the camshaft sensors have 3 pins in the electrical connector. With the sensor removed from the car and using a meter on the sensor pins, the faulty inlet camshaft sensor gave a resistance measurement between all of the 3 pins and the new sensor and exhaust camshaft sensor only did on 2 pins.

 

In the RTA manual for the 2.0 hdi C5 to 2004 model (DW10ATED), it gives the camshaft sensor as a 3 pin one and the resistance between pins 2 and 3 should be 576 ohms. If measuring the voltage from the sensor it should go between 0 and 5 volts. For the crank sensor it gives as a 2 wire one with a resistance between the pins of 475 ohms (+/- 50 ohms).

[Gilbern Invader]

Camshaft sensor is favourite but difficult to change as well hidden, has to be done with eyes closed if you see what I mean and don't drop the little screw! How about joining the AA or RAC? At least you will get a free diagnostic the next time it won't go.

[PaulLeonard]

Hi all.

 

Quick question.

 

What type of engine oil do I buy?

 

It's asking to top up.

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[paul.h]

Your handbook will tell you which engine oil to use but since you have a dpf it may be Total INEO ECS 5W30 full synthetic low saps oil. This can be obtained from a Citroen dealer or on-line..

[PaulLeonard]

Hi Paul

 

Thanks for the info.

 

I am getting a little confused on this oil issue

 

I googled Engine Oil Checker and I have searched Castrol, Mobil et al and they mostly say different 5W30 and 5W40. You say 5W30 so is that OK? LC03 XYB.

 

Took some prices down from the petrol station just down the bottom of my road.

 

Castrol Edge 0W30 @ £22.99 For BMW,Mini, and Mercs

1 Mobil New Life 0W40 @ £20.99

Castrol Edge 5W30 @ £20.99 For Audi, VW, BMW, Mini, Mercs, Porsche, Skoda and Seat

 

All Fully Synthetic

 

Thanks

 

Paul

[coastline taxis]

Did you get your starting problem sorted out

[PaulLeonard]

Hi CLT

 

Unfortunately not yet. I still owe the garage 200 for the other work when they also sorted the clutch. Paying that today.

 

I'll ask them about the camshaft sensors when I pay the bill

 

Paul