paul.h

Did the insurance cost any more ?

If the fan does not stop it may be the spark plugs need replacing, have a look at this info copied from Citroen Peugeot Specialists, North Circular Road, London http://www.citroenpeugeotspecialists.co.uk/news/common-faults-citroens/ Peugeot/citroen cars that are equipped with the 1.6/1.4 THP engine turbo or are normally aspirated are also a cause for concern. We are finding many problems relating to cooling fans are actually the result of misfire due to poor maintenance. A state of emergency is declared by the engine control unit (ECU) upon measuring a huge amount of knock and misfire. Often the fan doesn’t even want to switch off after ignition off and the battery has to be disconnected. However the solution is fairly simple, and indeed inspecting the spark plugs usually reveals that problem. The real issue is the length of service intervals and when the vehicle does go in for service, because of the very high cost of the plugs and the reluctance to include the cost within a “cheap serviceâ€, they end up staying in the vehicle forever! Full service history means nothing these days unless it is carried out by people who care and understand the vehicles they work on.

3 common problems in the link - C4 Picasso wiring looms getting water ingress due to the scuttle not draining - you can hear water moving about as a warning. - C3 Picasso fuse box getting water ingress needing a new engine fuse box and some wiring to replace the rotted wires. I think this fuse box is not that expensive. - 1.4 and 1.6 petrol engined cars, engine fan not stopping caused by not replacing the spark plugs often enough. I will do a separate topic on the fan one since you would never guess old spark plugs would affect the fan.

Welcome to the forum. Is the car a C3 or a C4 since you have posted in the C4 section ? What year is the car and which engine does it have ? Is this the engine fuse box ? Is the fuse box lid a good fit and all the box/lid in tact to prevent water getting in ? You may not believe this but it has been reported that water can work its way from the windscreen washer bottle through the washer pump wiring back to the engine fuse box - so if this is the problem you may need to replace the washer pump and wiring. I would check the battery voltage to see if it is in good condition since winter is the time they usually fail and first thing in the morning they may not start the car - you should have about 12.5 to 12.7 volts before starting the car and about 14.4 volts once running. Maybe disconnect the battery after its last run of the day and then leave overnight and then check its voltage again before connecting back up - it should still be about 12.5 volts if ok. If not, a new battery may be needed or it may need charging. If the battery is draining due to a short in the fuse box it may still have some water in it or maybe there is some damage that is causing a short. If it is not the fuse box you could remove each fuse in turn and use a meter in its place to check for a current drain to see which circuit is the problem. Do not be too quick to disconnect the battery, thisis from the C3 Common Problems topic: 20. Odd electrical problems caused by wrong battery disconnection procedure. If you need to disconnect the battery and not do a BSI reset procedure, I have found the following has not given me any problems on a 2004 and 2007 C5 and a 2003 C3: - remove the ignition key from the car - open the bonnet - wait a few minutes for the BSI to shut down - disconnect the battery negative terminal When reconnecting - ignition key out of the car - reconnect the battery - wait a few minutes - insert the key in the ignition and wait a minute - turn the key to the first position and wait a minute - turn the key so the dash lights come on and wait a minute - start the engine - take the windows down and up to reset the anti pinch - reset the clock (and radio on the C3).

http://www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/p/car-accessories/engine-oils-and-car-fluids/auxiliary-fluids/specialist-fluids/?524770302&0&cc5_871 eurocarparts do not say much about the PAT fluid, other than being universal but there is a bit more on Amazon so it appears to be ok to use https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Automotive/PAT-Fluid-1-Ltr-for-DPF-Exhausts/B008GRT2GW Your Citroen dealer seems expensive for everything, maybe they do not want any work. I thought the eolys was about £100 for 3 litres so they seem to want about £200 labour for about an hour - it might pay to enquire from a dealer in a different town with a lower labour rate if you want to pay somebody to put more fluid in.

I think the regeneration runs the engine at about 4000 rpm for about 20 minutes, so at the limit of its revs, hence the need to make sure it is in good condition and oil level ok. I do not know if the Lexia can do it since I do not have one but I suspect it can. Maybe a blocked dpf could give the P0238 fault code since it will cause a higher pressure than normal in the exhaust system as far as the dpf and maybe this also increases the manifold inlet pressure but this ought to be limited by the turbo controls. If it said the PAT fluid was empty then the counter/level in the tank would have gone down to zero, so somehow it has been reset back up to full at 3000 ml. I can not remember now, but when you replaced the dpf did you get a Citroen one or a pattern part, possibly a pattern part gives a higher pressure drop which shows as a high soot loading. I cannot remember what make of PAT fluid you put in, perhaps you can remind us, just in case it is not as effective as Citroen's eolys fluid.

Welcome to the forum. How many miles has the car done ? P0238 Turbocharger Boost Sensor A Circuit High An internet search will show this is a difficult fault to rectify and some have found replacing/cleaning the egr valve has worked. You could have a look at this topic as an example of the difficulty http://www.citroen-owners-club.co.uk/citroen/topic/24099-turbo-solenoid-valve-for-citroen-c4-16hdi-p0238/

Welcome to the forum.

I would also check the MAP sensor which measures the turbo pressure - it might be bunged up with oil or be faulty giving a high reading. When the engine management light comes on a fault code is generated and stored on the ecu until it has been deleted using a code reader, so no need to hope the light is still on when you go to a garage. There will also be freeze frame data stored giving the sensor values at the time of the fault and these may give a clue what is wrong. It is a pity/surprising the garage did not do these checks for you whilst it was plugged in. The MAP sensor might be part 1920LH, as well as the part you should check any connections/pipes are clean. As an example so you know what it looks like http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CITROEN-DS3-1-4-HDI-70-FROM-2010-AIR-MANIFOLD-PRESSURE-MAP-SENSOR-FACET-/171819159020

Some other things that might rattle are the exhaust and the exhaust metal heat shields if loose and worn engine mountings - just thinking of the last cheap things, hoping it is not going to cost a lot to sort out.

The PAT (eolys) fluid should last about 25k miles for a litre so you probably do not need to worry about it running out yet. The amount it shows in the tank is not an actual level measurement but a calculation on the number of diesel refills and should reduce each time you fill up. - possibly the magnets in the filler cap or the switch that senses it are not there/working to tell the ecu you have filled the tank up with diesel. If so this would not tell the car to inject the fluid in to the diesel tank which would gradually let the DPF block up - I would think the Lexia would be able to tell you if this is working - or maybe you could remove the filler cap and start the engine and see if you get a message to say the filler is open - our C5 gives a message but I am not sure about the C4. - the DPF could be blocked up due to many short trips so that the DPF does not get a chance to regenerate. - It could be the fluid injector is not working - I think it is possible to test this with the Lexia. Looking at the values on the Lexia: - the coolant temperature at 79°C is low, should be about 90°C unless the engine has not had time to warm up - the particle filter inlet / outlet pressure difference is 0 mbar - this suggests the dpf is not blocked, maybe it needs to be checked with a higher rpm or possibly the sensor/piping/connections are not right

Some info here on the Lexia http://www.citroen-owners-club.co.uk/citroen/topic/23278-lexia-diagbox-pp2000-topics-13112016/ Early C5s do not seem to work on many low cost readers but you have used the only diagnostic socket on the car.

I think 3000 rpm is about the limit when in limp mode. Also on a diesel if at 3000 rpm it should easily pull in a higher gear so you could change up a gear.

A quick check on if the MAF sensor is good enough will be to unplug it and see if the performance improves - it should get worse if the sensor is ok. When I have looked up boost pressures for others it seems to be in the range 0.6 to 0.9 bar with the higher value for larger engines. As Rookie2 has pointed out the speed up hills will depend on various things but I have not seen a van that can not keep up with the traffic unless it is heavily loaded.

I would plug it back into the scanner and see if the fault codes have gone (after deleting the old ones) and then with it plugged in look at the live data such as the boost pressure (MAP) whilst driving to see if anything shows up.

An example on ebay http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Citroen-Service-Box-1-2014-TIS-EPC-WDS-/381321373493 These are Citroen's workshop manuals that come on dvds that you load on to your computer. For some reason it is called Citroen Service Box but there are no boxes involved. Possibly there is damage to the switch wiring and it is touching the body work somewhere, if so you may need to follow the wiring from the switch to the fuse box to check it. If there is an electrical connection at the brake fluid reservoir you could disconnect this to see if it is the level switch giving the problem.

Pleased it is sorted, probably have a heat wave now and the warmest winter ever.

I think Haynes call the socket in the centre console the rear one. It shows fuse F9 as being the 3rd in from the left on the bsi. I would first check for 12 volts here. I suspect the wiring will run under the central console to the front, if not it may run along the left hand sill but it may be easiest to start at the socket and follow the wiring. A quick check to see if the socket has an earth is to use your meter on ohms with one lead touching the outer metal of the socket and the other to a metal part of the body and if ok you should have negligible resistance.

What year is your C4 ? Have you checked the socket with the engine running since on our C4 it is only live when running ? If it is the 2004 to 2010 model then the Haynes manual gives the fuse for the front 12 volt socket as the bsi fuse F8 20 amp and it also does the radio. If it is the rear 12 volt socket and cigarette lighter then it gives the fuse as F9 30 amp. Have you used a volt meter to check for 12 volts at the socket, its wiring connector and also that the earth for the socket is good ? If you have been doing your checks using a plug in the socket and not a volt meter then maybe the plug is not reaching the positive middle connection in the socket. When checking the wiring if you do not have 12 volts at the socket and its connector, then check at the fuse and work towards the socket.

If you want a workshop manual you can get the Citroen service box to put on your pc through ebay. It comes on 3 dvds and includes wiring diagrams and parts diagrams.

Check the lds fluid level if not already done, with the suspension at minimum height the lds level should be just covering the bottom of the lds tank strainer. Then if the level is low you need to look for a leak with the steering rack being a common one. Also have a look at this in case the pump motor needs a clean internally http://www.citroen-owners-club.co.uk/citroen/topic/23976-c5-suspension-fault-pump-maxi-fuse-blowing-fault-code-p1351/

Hopefully this is the end of the tyre wear problem. It may pay to feel the tread (run a hand over it) for uneven wear in a few months as an early check to see if it has been cured. How do the new tyres compare against the old ones for noise ?

The only times I have ever decoked engines have been when they have been in bits due to a cylinder head or head gasket problem and it was done using scrapers/files/emery paper/solvents/paraffin. I have never felt the need to do it when a car has been running well. What I have seen in a quick look on the internet, using water spray seems to be on petrol engines and the water sprayed in to the carburettor inlet so not going through an intercooler/turbo. If you wanted to try it on your engine it would probably need spraying in at the inlet manifold at a pressure above the turbo pressure.

To check the battery voltage you just need a volt meter such as this from Toolstation for under £10 http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Electrical/d190/Electrical+Test+Equipment/sd3348/Digital+Multi+Meter/p11867 and then if it needs charging do a few long runs or use a battery charger, still a lot cheaper than a diagnostic check.

Does the engine management light come on when it stalls ? When was the fuel filter last changed ? If the petrol station sells a lot of fuel then by now I would have thought it would be selling winter diesel but I would think summer fuels would still be ok unless you are getting below freezing - this gives some info and it looks as if winter fuels should be sold from November https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_diesel_fuel . It could well be an ecu/wiring problem that is stopping the engine so you could have a look for any damaged wiring around the engine. Ideally you need to plug the car into a code reader that does live data so you can see what is happening rather than guessing.